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Daly has no expectations for Wednesday’s CBA talks

Nov 20, 2012, 3:22 PM EDT

BillDaly

Wednesday could mark a major turning point in CBA negotiations between the NHL and NHLPA; however, deputy commissioner Bill Daly isn’t getting his hopes up.

Or down, if you’re an optimist.

“I don’t have any expectations at this point,” Daly wrote to the Chicago Tribune in an e-mail.

Daly has expressed frustration at what he deems the NHLPA’s unwillingness to compromise on the issues that continue to divide the two sides. Thus, the importance of tomorrow’s talks when the players are expected to present the NHL with a new offer.

“If their proposal continues to be a guaranteed amount of players’ share dollars,” Daly said Monday, “we have told them that sitting here on Nov. 19, that’s not a proposal that is acceptable to us or would ever be acceptable to our owners right now.”

Daly is also hoping the union’s proposal will encompass all the issues, not just a select few.

“We think it’s all tied together and we’d like to hear it all together,” he said.

Safe to say, if the union maintains its demands for a guaranteed dollar amount of revenue and/or doesn’t address all the issues in its proposal, tomorrow will not bring this dispute any closer to a resolution.

In fact, it may drive the sides further apart.

Related: If the NHLPA moves on economics and the NHL moves on contracting rights, do we have a deal?

  1. kcprof926 - Nov 20, 2012 at 3:27 PM

    I am a Hawks season tix holder and I am losing a lot of interest in the NHL. Unlike the NFL, it is a sport I love yet could live without. Both sides should be embarrassed and if they do come back all should boycott their first game to show them they need us the fans.

    • jimw81 - Nov 21, 2012 at 12:16 AM

      nfl is destroying it’s product with fantasy football. it has turned the sport into dungeon and dragons. i don’t care how many points player x score for the day on the bottom scroll on tv screen. College football is better than nfl because you can schedule an inferior team on your schedule and still make it to the national championship game.

      • blomfeld - Nov 21, 2012 at 12:56 AM

        that’s an excellent point Jimw81 which I agree with completely ! :)

  2. capsrockva - Nov 20, 2012 at 3:32 PM

    Just get the deal done. I’m tired of not watching Hockey. Just glad the NBC Sports Network has added more College hockey games to their schedule

  3. ron05342 - Nov 20, 2012 at 3:34 PM

    “In fact, it may drive the sides further apart.”

    I am so tired of this sh*t. These guys ought to tell each other what they WON’T compromise on, and if happens to be this issue, then call the fu*king season off already.

  4. bleedingteal4life - Nov 20, 2012 at 3:44 PM

    What’s really sad is that the NHL and the nhlpa will have no consequences for treating the fans so poorly. This is just a blatant abuse of power, and guess what folks…we can’t to sh*t about it. In the end we, the fans, will have to just bend over and take what they give us. How could they even begin to compensate us for the damage that has already been done…they won’t!

    • id4joey - Nov 20, 2012 at 6:46 PM

      The PR machine will have to go in full throttle to bring some of the fans back, and year over year their fan base will increase, although never to the level of the other sports. And you know what, I think these guys are ok with this fact.

    • id4joey - Nov 20, 2012 at 8:30 PM

      “compensate us for the damage that has already been done” are you kidding me? Compensation should be awarded by Goldman Sachs, the credit agency, Wall Street, Enron, and Madoff, to all those who lost their life savings because of all the greedy and fraudulent behavior. This includes the hypocrisy of the govt who chose to turn a blind eye. Give me a break…… Please.

  5. thedavesiknowiknow - Nov 20, 2012 at 3:57 PM

  6. sheckyrimshot - Nov 20, 2012 at 4:01 PM

    someone tell this stunad that “compromise” does not mean “you cave into all our demands”

    • bmscalise - Nov 20, 2012 at 4:44 PM

      I have no particular love for the owners and believe the handled this negotiation horribly. But do you actually realize what Daly is saying? The players are still asking for every dollar of their contracts – without consideration for the lost games. Not a percentage to account for a 50 game season – but all of it. The percentage of revenues that salaries would add up to this year would be far, far more than even the 57% players got last year. And since revenues next year will almost certainly be less than 3.3 billion, given an alienated fan base, the % the players would get if contracts are guaranteed would be significantly more than the 50/50 split expected.

      There’s absolutely no way the owners can agree guarantee contracts to the dollar at this point. They can and should bend at least some on contracting rights, but the guaranteed money is a understandable non-starter for the league. And yet the PA keeps demanding it. I suspect its to prove a philosophical point: the owners are responsible entirely for the lockout. Which – given the stall tactics the PA has used throughout the process – is just bs.

      • chrisvegas - Nov 20, 2012 at 4:52 PM

        The owners caused the lockout and they got paid for their TV contract this season, so maybe they should pay those salaries. This is their fault. Either way that is just more BS from Daly. If they come to a fair deal the players would obviously work that out and compromise. The owners started this type of negotiating with their joke of a 1st offer. I love how nothing is the owners fault, atleast that is the Owner’s additude.

      • bmscalise - Nov 20, 2012 at 5:04 PM

        @chrisvegas- Sorry, but it just isn’t that simple. I actually fall slightly on the side of the players – but this mess is definitely the fault of BOTH sides.

        The PA didn’t even submit a proposal of any kind to the league until shortly before the lockout. And then they waited weeks for the league to submit back-to-back proposals without giving any of their own. The players hired Fehr to navigate a work stoppage – one they expected and had every intention of using to gain their own leverage. And they’ve regularly used tactics to prolong it.

      • id4joey - Nov 20, 2012 at 6:50 PM

        You believe owners handled it horribly because your perspective is skewed. You are looking at the situation from the perspective of a fan. Look at it from an owners/business perspective, and you may see things differently. Maybe they handled it just right to accomplish their objectives.

      • bmscalise - Nov 20, 2012 at 7:39 PM

        @id4joey – My fan perspective? As a fan – I don’t give a rat’s behind what the CBA looks like, provided it gets done (with the exception of the salary cap, which I believe is crucial to the success of small markets.) I have no investment in either side, so I judge based on the behavior I see.

        The owner’s greatly miscalculated with that polarizing initial offer, which showed utter contempt for the other side of the table. I would bet the league wishes it could take it back that strategy. They clearly had no intention of negotiating until after a work stoppage was in place, with the expectation that they could bully the PA into an array of concessions. Businessmen would have made their business’s growth a priority above sticking it to their employees. And these businessmen didn’t.

        The PA has behaved just as badly – but this lockout has always been less about money and more about egos.

        On the other hand, I believe their insistence on eliminated back-diving contracts is completely reasonable.

      • chrisvegas - Nov 20, 2012 at 8:16 PM

        @bmscalise – You claim you lean “slightly” towards the players but it really doesn’t sound that way. Yes, this is 100% the owner’s fault that they went into a lockout. 1) The owners voted for a lockout rather than playing under the previous season’s rules for the CBA. They could have used this season to negotiate without having a work stoppage. It wouldn’t have killed them. With such a vast increase in TV revenue they could have easily done this. 2) They started off the negotiations with a contract that was beyond insulting. Not a good way to bring the sides together. All this after owners spent ridiculous amounts of money signing players to long term contracts just this past summer. How did they expect the players to respond? You spend your money like Paris Hilton on a shopping spree, and then you claim you can’t afford to pay the bill when you clearly can afford it. 3) The owners much like the typical billionaires on Wall Street claimed they are losing money and want the players and the fans to bail them out. Billionaires you see are always losing money and are never responsible for their mistakes. The owners are the problem. 3 lockouts in 20 years and they can never seem to get it right. Players come and go but the owners stay the same. Look at the constant, because that is where the problem lies. Furthermore, you are putting too much stock into proposal submissions. Just because a former proposal isn’t submitted doesn’t mean there isn’t negotiations happening. The former proposals are more or less for the media and the fans. Both sides know what the other ones want. The players have moved to giving revenue up. The players have conceded in many areas, the owners have not given up one SINGLE thing in this whole negotiation.

      • id4joey - Nov 20, 2012 at 8:21 PM

        I think the league never intended to get a deal done before December. Their law firm and math wizards probably came up with a formula based on statistics that proved their tactics would minimize damages in the short term, and allow them to make up for lost revenue in the short term. I’m not saying they are right, however, I’m convinced every step has been well calculated and thought out. Like I said, they have a very big sports management law firm on their side.

      • chrisvegas - Nov 20, 2012 at 8:31 PM

        @id4joey – You are probably right about that. Anyone who thinks this lockout wasn’t calculated by the owners is foolish. Billionaires always calculate everything. They’ve been planning for this for a while now and all one has to do is to look at how they negotiated their TV contract. They worked a deal out that dealt with missing an entire season due to a lockout.

      • bmscalise - Nov 20, 2012 at 10:56 PM

        @chrisvegas – You’ve certainly bought into Fehr’s spin hook, line, and sinker.

        Look, I will support whatever policies allow for successful and sustainable small markets. I could give a hooey about either side in this negotiation.

        First – the players would play without a CBA? That’s such a straw-man argument on the part of the PA. No league would EVER play without a CBA. Why would the players negotiate then? We’d just be at this point next year – without either side having budged at all during this “negotiating period.” If neither side was willing to negotiate over this past summer – what makes you think they’d negotiate during a non-CBA year. It’s a garbage argument.

        I sympathize with the players argument about the pre-lockout contracts. And I can understand why they want to keep their contracting rights. But – the NHL had a substantially more player-friendly deal than any other capped sport. The percentage of revenue was better – the contracting rights were better. And a good portion of the teams in the league are bleeding money. Not to mention that a good portion of fans dislike the back-diving deals: they are as likely to lead to disaster as they are to on-ice success. On those two fronts – there was nowhere to go but down.

        I completely agree that Leipold’s behavior has been beyond sleazy. But what about Nashville? They had to put their franchise at risk in order to keep their captain. They have a local ownership – not an Ed Snider. They should have been able to show their commitment to their fan base without risking bankruptcy. And they do have a fan base. I live in KY – and the only hockey gear I’ve seen is Pens, Hawks, and Preds. (Disclosure: I’m a Pens fan from Pgh.)

        What did the owners give up? The players couldn’t have expected better than the last CBA in terms or either HRR or contracting. They got a 7 year gift of a CBA last time. And the owner have given up the only thing they really could: revenue-sharing. The players were right to ask for better – and they got it. I don’t know why this is never stated – because it’s a really big deal.

        The players should concede to a REAL 50% share over 2-3 years – and the owners should give it. The owners should agree to let the players keep their arbitration rights and FA age – in order to get the 5% variance on contracts. After all, it’s only a few high-end players that ever benefit from this – players that will get their pay day anyway. That’s what would be fair. That’s what would allow for the success of small markets without needlessly eroding player rights. That’s what would be best for the health of the league.

        If I seem pro-owner, it’s only because – at this stage – the owners seem to have come far closer to those conditions that I see as ideal than the players have. If you had asked me in Oct, my answer would have been different. But watching Fehr’s tactics – and the staunch refusal of the PA to move from their ridiculous stance of 1.8 billion guaranteed – has soured me to the PA’s message.

      • blomfeld - Nov 21, 2012 at 1:21 AM

        “Leipold’s behavior has been beyond sleazy” …

        Bmscalise – That’s very true, just as the white man’s behavior towards the native Indians here in North America was beyond sleazy. But such is the way, as no two things in life will ever have an equal chance …

      • chrisvegas - Nov 21, 2012 at 1:06 PM

        @BMSCALISE – It isn’t a garbage argument. You’re buying into the owner’s poor behavior that a lockout is the only way to get the deal they want. This behavior will lead to a lockout every seven years and is why we have had 3 lockouts in 20 years. We see for instance the NFL negotiate CBA deals without ever going into a long term lockout and missing regular season games. Why? Because the damage it does to the game is far more costly then revenue splits. A lockout isn’t the only way a deal can be done. A lockout isn’t good for anyone and it damages the game by turning fans off and hurts the economy. Nobody said that a deal would be easy. Your argument is that the only way a deal could get negotiated is by having a lockout this season, and that is an idiotic argument. It is bad business. The owners could have opted to play the season under the previous CBA rules, so there would be a CBA for one more year giving them time to negotiate. To think they couldn’t be negotiating while hockey was being played is not true. This all could have been avoided. The owners came right out of the gates with a horrible offer all but guaranteeing a lockout. What you keep failing to acknowledge is the fact that we have lockouts every 7 years while other sports are avoiding them. Why? At what point to you look the horrible lockout record in the NHL and say to yourself why can’t these owners negotiate in good faith and avoid these disasters they keep dragging the hockey world into? Wake up!

      • thebigeasy2002 - Nov 21, 2012 at 1:48 PM

        @bmcalise – So by your estimation the only way the owners can negotiate with the players is to actually be in a lockout? So we should expect a lockout every 7 years is what you are saying since they can’t negotiate until the lockout is in effect?

  7. stain67 - Nov 20, 2012 at 4:18 PM

    If the players want to get paid this year, they will come with a legit proposal.
    They know what is and is not acceptable to the owners. I believe the owners continue to have the leverage.
    I will say this again….Players Salaries will be there with a 50/50 split and the partial make whole the league is offering. Forget about guarenteed money, a whole season is impossible at this point. You will be paid for the games played.
    Players lost a whole season fighting the cap….but they continue to make more and more money.
    The same will happen here…IMO, if they settle this before they hurt the game and the fans further…..

    • chrisvegas - Nov 20, 2012 at 4:35 PM

      Or they can just keep getting paid over seas until the Owners fold or atleast become reasonable.

      • stain67 - Nov 20, 2012 at 5:47 PM

        Im not sure where you have been the last few months, but the owners are not folding.
        They will not settled until there is a 50/50 split.
        When a new CBA is negotiated, contracts are “tweaked” accordingly…so the owners offering any “make whole” provision is very reasonable.
        Not to mention, only a small percentage of players are getting paid overseas….and are paying huge premiums to protect their NHL contracts. If you think they are getting rich over there….you are mistaken.

      • chrisvegas - Nov 20, 2012 at 8:25 PM

        @stain – There is just as much pressure (if not more) on the owners to settle then the players. The players don’t have to pay the mortgage on these stadiums. The players don’t have to pay for employees, their healthcare ect… Not to mention the Owners look like idiots for getting themselves in another lockout in a time when the game was thriving. Players can afford to live in their paid off homes while they get paid to play over seas. Yes it isn’t as much, but then again they don’t have as much overhead as the owners do. If you think the owners can hold out forever you are mistaken. They will eventually get more pressure on them the longer this goes on.

  8. blomfeld - Nov 20, 2012 at 4:32 PM

    or would ever be acceptable to our owners “right now” …

    Not sure if anyone else has picked up on this “right now” qualifier of Daly’s ? I find that to be very quizzical and interesting ? Why does he add that and not just leave it at “ever” ? Regardless, something seriously “stinks” about this entire business. And therefore I remain convinced that a “premeditated” plan is playing out here with a “premeditated” end date now fast approaching. As you know, I thought that date would come during the week of Nov 5-10 ? Well despite the sudden burst of hope that week, nothing became of it in the end. And so here we are two weeks later. It’s possible friends that I was off with my thinking by a period of some days, which isn’t so unreasonable, given the fact that I made my postulation way back on September 16th ? Anyway, we’ll see now pretty quickly, one way or the other, eh ? :)

    • mgp1219 - Nov 20, 2012 at 4:56 PM

      “Stupid”

      • blomfeld - Nov 20, 2012 at 5:35 PM

        you’re not stupid friend … and besides, even if you are, don’t ever forget that God loves everyone ! :)

    • phillyphanatic77 - Nov 20, 2012 at 9:09 PM

      Blom just admit your conspiracy theory was wrong. There is no secret plan by Bettman to move the season’s starting date to November. The only thing premeditated about this whole ordeal is that Bettman knew well before the CBA expired that he would be locking out the league, as his one and only bargaining chip, in order to strong arm the union into accepting another lopsided deal. No matter how many times you told us everything that happened was all part of some master plan, it never changed the fact that you were doing nothing more than presenting an unfounded theory. The only one who bought in was Id4joey and you were both wrong. Your target date has come and gone, and the resolution is still far off. Your baseless optimism wasn’t just off by a period of some days. Stop pretending you know more than any other speculators on PHT.

      • blomfeld - Nov 21, 2012 at 1:33 AM

        “No, I’m not going to say that !”

        You my friend are wrong, not me ! It was I and “I” alone, who accurately predicted that this was nothing more than a premeditated and “contrived” plan right from the start. And now the events of the forthcoming days are about to prove me right ! Nonetheless, I couldn’t care less about personal vindication. My only hope and wish is that this idiocy now comes to a conclusion, so that we can all again enjoy the game which we love.

      • phillyphanatic77 - Nov 21, 2012 at 2:16 AM

        Haha how can it be an accurate prediction when you got the entire timeline (that your whole conspiracy is based on) wrong? I can wholeheartedly agree that this whole thing is completely idiotic, especially coming off a season of record revenue and unprecedented fan enthusiasm. I truly hope you prove me wrong and that this all ends in the coming days, but so far you’ve been mistaken.

      • id4joey - Nov 21, 2012 at 3:24 AM

        Phillyphanatic77, were you wearing that costume in 1977? Anyway! I respect the fact that you don’t believe in the conspiracy theory, but you have to be consistent in your comments. You write, “Haha how can it be an accurate prediction when you got the entire timeline wrong?”, then, “I truly hope you prove me wrong and that this all ends in the coming days, but so far you’ve been mistaken.” So, which is it? In your opinion, is blomfeld completely wrong, or is there a chance he was right? If there’s still a chance, then you can’t say he was wrong.

      • phillyphanatic77 - Nov 22, 2012 at 11:49 AM

        Id4joey, nothing I said is contradictory. Everyone wants the lockout to end, that’s a given, I was merely making that point. That doesn’t mean blomfeld was accurate in his prediction, because his prediction was that there was a premeditated plan by Bettman to settle the lockout in early November in an attempt to move the regular seasons annual starting date there. blom said “and now the events of the forthcoming days are about to prove me right”, and I responded to that that I hope he’s correct so that hockey comes back. But that wasn’t part of his original prediction.

  9. joeyashwi - Nov 20, 2012 at 4:51 PM

    Bettman is worth more than the paltry $8 million a year he makes. Cut player salaries and give him a raise. He is a true leader. There are a handful of players in the league who make more than him. That just isn’t right. He should be the highest paid man in the league for all he does for the game and its fans. I hope Daly and Fehr are also being compensated well for the excellent job they are doing. My heroes.

    • woodstakes - Nov 21, 2012 at 1:08 AM

      Boy, unless you are related to any of aforementioned… I certainly hope that statement was dripping with sarcasm.. if not, please, please PLEASE for the love of all things never, ever, EVER procreate!!

  10. buffalo65 - Nov 20, 2012 at 4:52 PM

    Spring training in 3 months…..

    • ron05342 - Nov 20, 2012 at 5:40 PM

      I love baseball. Whenever I need a mid-afternoon nap, I turn on the game and stretch it out on the couch.

      I’m out within 10 minutes.

    • capsrockva - Nov 20, 2012 at 9:38 PM

      Then get off a hockey page. Baseball is a wimp sport. How many games are canceled by rain or postponed to a little water 2010′ Winter Classic was just moved back to 8 cause of rain, but never canceled!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

  11. shotzongoal - Nov 20, 2012 at 6:20 PM

    Yes many players are playing overseas for just a fraction of what they earned here. What I’d like to know is why in Russia for example, Why is it that the players are playing for 35% less then they are willing to play for me?

    • woodstakes - Nov 21, 2012 at 1:12 AM

      They are ONLY getting paid those salaries because the KHL honor’s contracts in the NHL and there for looks at these players as mere substitute players. IF the NHL ever decided to use replacements you’d see contracts falling from the skies and large multi-year contracts that pay more than the NHL pays. Need proof… Alexander Semin: KHL offer: $10M multi-year / NHL offer: $6M one year… if SEMIN gets $10M, what do you think Ovie, Crosby, Malkin, Stampkos, Kovy, Parise, Weber, Nash, Suter, Sedins, etc etc etc would get??? More than Semin and that would be more than they make now!

  12. mississippimudslinger - Nov 20, 2012 at 8:32 PM

    2012-2013 NHL season
    nah ..nah ..nah.. nah
    nah ..nah ..nah ..nah
    hey..hey…hey
    goodbye!

    cmon ya’ll sing along!

    • capsrockva - Nov 20, 2012 at 9:40 PM

      u must not be a hockey fan

    • blomfeld - Nov 21, 2012 at 1:36 AM

  13. daburghdabest - Nov 20, 2012 at 8:58 PM

    And if anyone is very familiar with the idea of “no expectations” it’s everyone that’s ever known Bill Daly.

    • blomfeld - Nov 21, 2012 at 1:37 AM

  14. capsrockva - Nov 20, 2012 at 9:15 PM

    In my opinion, from a fans point of view, this lockout is 90% on the owners. They should’ve started talking long before 9/15 say right after the finals last year. Both sides knew the CBA would expire on 9/15. Just get this dam deal done already, please for the the people who are losing every night. The fans and I’m missing playing fantasy hockey right now. There is no fantasy hockey league for college hockey that I know of , is there is I wouldn’t know the players except for a few from MN and or ND

  15. mississippimudslinger - Nov 20, 2012 at 11:19 PM

    Capsrockvirginia, why are you in such a hurry to resume play?? it’s not like ya’ll will ever win a Stanley Cup , pipe down there kiddo , the season’s over even if it does by miracle or fluke ever start !

    • blomfeld - Nov 21, 2012 at 1:38 AM

  16. slickvb82 - Nov 20, 2012 at 11:51 PM

    @chrisvegas

    when will you get your head out of your ass and realize its not just the owners??

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