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Montreal not budging on its two-year offer to Subban

Jan 26, 2013, 9:42 AM EDT

P.K. Subban AP

P.K. Subban is still unsigned in Montreal and it sounds like Habs GM Marc Bergevin has made a stand.

Renaud Lavoie from RDS reports the team is sticking to the same two-year offer they made to the restricted free agent back in May worth a total of $5.1 million. Montreal has held firm in wanting a short-term deal while Subban wants the exact opposite.

What seems clear here is that Montreal is comparing Subban to fellow RFA defensemen, Michael Del Zotto and Dmitry Kulikov. Del Zotto signed a two-year, $5.2 million deal with the Rangers right before training camp while Kulikov re-upped with the Panthers for two years at $5 million.

When you look at the raw numbers, the comparison to Del Zotto isn’t so far-fetched. That said, Subban’s importance to the Habs and their future on the blue line as well as their salary cap health next season ($53 million committed to just 16 players according to CapGeek) helps give you the stalemate we’re in now.

Perhaps this situation might wind up seeing Subban traded after all.

Related

Subban needs weekend to reflect after Habs meeting

Subban: “I want to be paid what I’m worth”

PHT Extra: Should the Habs trade PK Subban?

  1. steelers88 - Jan 26, 2013 at 10:22 AM

    Well if the NHL thing doesn’t work out maybe the Yankees will sign him.

  2. oquintero99 - Jan 26, 2013 at 10:35 AM

    Seems like they are very far apart in terms.

    • 19to77 - Jan 26, 2013 at 1:05 PM

      Because Subban doesn’t seem able to grasp that he’s not worth the rest of Montreal’s entire salary cap.

  3. nogoodtomedead - Jan 26, 2013 at 10:55 AM

    Question to Habs fans: How good is this guy?

    I’m a Sharks fan in CA, so I don’t see many games he plays in- I know he has offensive talent- but mostly hear about him for his various antics that have pissed people off- do you all want a long-term deal- or you think the GM is right on?

    • mikebel11 - Jan 26, 2013 at 11:18 AM

      He’s a very good player. Obviously leading the team in ice time last year. He’s always ha the offensive game and his defensive side has certainly rounded into shape recently. I would love to see him locked up long term but the way I see it Bergevin is trying to do him a favor here. He can’t afford to lock up a tonne of money next year but Gionta, Markov and Kaberle all come off the cap after next season creating 15 million in cap space which would allow him to be much more handsomely compensated than if he were to sign long term now.

      • valoisvipers - Jan 26, 2013 at 5:41 PM

        Mikebel11 His offensive upside was only good for 7 goals, hardly a threat now is it. Lots of guys go skate up the ice with the puck but not get any results(Max Afinaganov of Buffalo WAS a good example of this) You also talk of 2 dmen and a top 6 forward coming off the books but you have to replace these guys so they can’t give it all away to PK and his potential. I say sign for what the Habs are offering and prove if you can that you are a mature top 4 d’man or sit out in the hope of being traded.

      • elrock7 - Jan 27, 2013 at 11:43 AM

        He scores the odd PP goal once in a while. He is horrible defensively, I have never sween anybody give the puck away more than him. 2 yrs and 5.1 mil is still too high to pay for a hot-headed defensive liability of questionable offensive skill

    • nogoodtomedead - Jan 26, 2013 at 2:44 PM

      Haha- was just checking in to see responses to the question I posed- how can this get a thumbs down?

    • warpstonebc - Jan 26, 2013 at 4:08 PM

      Subban was a +9 on absolutely awful team last year. The comparable to Del Zotto is not there. Breaking the $3m per season barrier for him is a no-brainer. How much more than that is he worth? It’s up for debate.

      Given that the Habs have nothing else to indicate that ship will turn around, possibly overpaying for a player who may indeed be your blue-chip defencemen for 5-6 years is not a horrible idea.

      • stakex - Jan 26, 2013 at 5:07 PM

        The Del Zotto comparison is actually spot on. Subban had worse numbers all around then Del Zotto last year, plus hes prone to take really bad penelties. The only mark against DZ is that he didn’t play very good in his second year, but hes clearly made up for that.

        The numbers from last season:

        Subban – 7g, 29a (36pt), +9, 119 PM and a .034 S%
        Del Zotto – 10g, 31a, (41pt), +20, 36PM and a .088 S%

        Del Zotto also played four less games then Subban and saw less ice time. So the argument that Subban is a much better player and worst 15-20% more money a year is laughable. Hes worth about the same as Del Zotto in the overall market. The only fair argument is that hes worth more to Montreal then DZ is to the Rangers since Montreal doesn’t have as good a defense. Still though Montreal has the upper hand because no other team is likely to give Subban much more then $2.5 million for a couple years.

    • hockeywithdrawal - Jan 26, 2013 at 10:26 PM

      Without him they are 2 and 1 and have only let in 4 goals total. 7th in the league in fewest shots against per game. Trade this arrogant distraction, or spread word for someone to make him a deal and take the comp drafts. They don’t need him.

    • hockeyflow33 - Jan 27, 2013 at 12:35 AM

      Other than shooting from the point on a power play, he’s certainly not someone you have to game plan for.

  4. nyrangersfan - Jan 26, 2013 at 11:35 AM

    Correction, Subban said he wants to get paid what he’s “worph.”

    • zetaone - Jan 26, 2013 at 12:34 PM

      Have you ever heard him speak? He’s whiter than Brad Marchand.

      • 19to77 - Jan 26, 2013 at 1:02 PM

        Ha! Nice.

  5. cspsrbums - Jan 26, 2013 at 11:54 AM

    Sure the Caps could use him

  6. cavafox - Jan 26, 2013 at 12:26 PM

    Couple more skate slashes and slew foots from him until he gets the shannaban. He’s a dirty player.

  7. darksidecowboy - Jan 26, 2013 at 12:27 PM

    Say goodbye Montreal, wearing a NY hat could it be fate? Possibly joining Tavares and Islanders? He’d probably love the attention in NY and with the team moving to Brooklyn in a couple years it would be perfect. Maybe he’s not worth 5 million but 2.5 for couple years? Better get a good return with the trade, because no way he accepts that offer.

    • stakex - Jan 26, 2013 at 5:11 PM

      Then hes not going to be playing. The guys simply not worth much more then that, at least not yet. For the numbers he put up (and no one looks at how good or bad your team was) his market value is exactlly what Montreal has offered him. For what ever reason hes been over blown in the media, and a lot of fans think hes some amazing player worth tons of money. When you actually look at his numbers though, and compare them to other players who signed under the new CBA….. Subbans ego is making him think hes worth more then his stats say he is.

  8. wingsfan13 - Jan 26, 2013 at 1:29 PM

    Montreal should be careful here, young talented D-Men are coveted throughout the league. I can think of more than one team looking for services he is offering, we would welcome him with open arms in Detroit. It might even be a good marketing move considering the diversity thing. Just sayin!!

    • hockeyflow33 - Jan 27, 2013 at 12:36 AM

      Doubtful, he’s a 3rd or 4th defenseman

  9. sergeikremlin - Jan 26, 2013 at 1:30 PM

    Wow, no wonder Subban feels undervalued. he should be getting at least 3 mill per, if not 3.5 or more.

    • hockeywithdrawal - Jan 26, 2013 at 10:27 PM

      WHY. That’s WAY too much.

  10. habsman - Jan 26, 2013 at 2:04 PM

    Here is Montreal’s dilema.

    They are putting a value of 2.5M to 3.0M on signing Subban short term. However, they would demand premium value if they decide to trade him. Contradiction?

    They might have signed him to a long term contract if they had a better cap space situation, but he still has some “growing up” to do which makes it risky right now.

    Bottom line, I don’t see the Habs trading him. Lets remember, he scored 14 goals as a rookie and has the “potential” to be one of the top offensive d-men in the league. Two years @ 3M would be fair.

  11. dfpoor - Jan 26, 2013 at 2:29 PM

    Dude looked pretty grown up last year with 24:00 TOI, 200 SOG, and 100 PIM.

    • habsman - Jan 26, 2013 at 2:42 PM

      I was referring to his attitude and his relationship with his teamates, not his production.

  12. valoisjoeybfeld69 - Jan 26, 2013 at 2:43 PM

    Habs gave UFA Prust 2.5m p/year. Least they can do is give the home grown boy 4m p/year.

  13. kingjoe1 - Jan 26, 2013 at 3:08 PM

    Lets go Homer, the Flyers need him badly. 5 years at 29 million. Give up the 1 and 3 and move on.

    • macjacmccoy - Jan 26, 2013 at 4:19 PM

      Yea I dont get why the Flyers havent acted yet. Maybe they have and the offer sheet hasnt been reported and 1 of the things Subban is thinking over this weekend is offer sheets he’s been given by the Flyers and other teams. The only reason I see Holmgren against trying to bring him to Philly is the whole Dry Island thing. They traded, cut, and let walk a big chunk of their team a little over a year ago because they wanted higher character players and better chemistry in the locker room. Maybe whats keeping them from acting is Subban’s reputation and the fact that he has had more then a few run ins with current Flyers players and is reviled by the team.

      • kingjoe1 - Jan 26, 2013 at 7:07 PM

        That is possible, not real sure. With the Weber offer sheet Homer did over the summer it is obvious the Flyers arent scared off by losing picks. While it is very possible that the Habs match, unless there are unknown issues with PK, the Flyers need this guy. Kimmo is gone after this year and Mezaros too.

      • muckthefets23 - Jan 27, 2013 at 3:28 AM

        I’m shocked myself the Flyers havent jumped on this already, Subban is young himself and the fly boys arent exactly old either already. Giving up picks shouldnt be too big a deal. I do have reservations about Subban’s team chemistry but we need a good D man badly. It is a distinct possibility that it could make or break the flyers season.

    • hockeywithdrawal - Jan 26, 2013 at 11:18 PM

      He’d make the perfect Flyer, that’s for sure. He fits the mold as far as the type of player they typically sign, perfectly.

      Did you really just say that you’d pay this guy 6M a year?

  14. hy3rid28 - Jan 26, 2013 at 4:15 PM

    wow Montreal is really low balling subban on this… 2.5mil per year?… come on over to Philly we can use you

  15. arbruins - Jan 26, 2013 at 7:03 PM

    I thought it would have been nice if the bruins could sign him, now that I see he is a Yankees fan…that kind of changes things. I hope is brother likes the Sox.

    • hockeyflow33 - Jan 27, 2013 at 12:39 AM

      That’s because you didn’t start watching hockey until Game 3 of the Cup Finals in 2011.

      • kgrant12 - Jan 27, 2013 at 8:20 AM

        Boston doesn’t have a bandwagon fanbase

      • hockeyflow33 - Jan 27, 2013 at 10:21 PM

        I pray that’s sarcasm

  16. broadstbully33 - Jan 26, 2013 at 9:05 PM

    Del zotto also plays in a far far better than team then Suban so comparing their years is a lost argument.

  17. mclovinhockey - Jan 26, 2013 at 9:46 PM

    The biggest problem with Subban other than his attitude (which is usually cheery) and his antics being pretty dirty, is his ability to turn the puck over. I live in Montreal and always liked Subban even before he was drafted, but he blew several games last year, I was so pissed at him even though my team is Philly haha. Give him a few years to calm down and maybe he can turn golden

  18. woodstakes - Jan 27, 2013 at 1:20 AM

    I guess to me its pretty simple.. he thinks he’s worth about twice that of DZ.. OK. Montreal has offered him about $2.5M per for a couple years. He says no.. So he seems to be pretty sure he is worth more. As a RFA who else has tendered him an offer… .. . Oh yeah, NO ONE!! Hey, Subban why do ya think that is kid?? Del Zotto has better numbers and signed for about what your being offered, OBVIOUSLY everyone else in the NHL thinks your not worth more than what DZ got. IF anything your worth MORE to Montreal than you would be to a lot of other teams and they aren’t buying into it!

    It’s pretty simple Subban… if you were worth $5M per on a long term deal and Montreal was offering you $2.5M… you’d have already received a proverbial TON of OFFER SHEETS!! Hmmm, wonder why you haven’t had any???????

  19. maylikethemonth - Jan 27, 2013 at 1:40 AM

    Flyers offer sheet??

    • muckthefets23 - Jan 27, 2013 at 3:34 AM

      Give it just a bit longer, Homer will pull the trigger, especially with Meszároš going down with an injury again. At least Briere is back too, but with hartnell out 4 to 6 too the D is even more critical at this point.

      • bcjim - Jan 27, 2013 at 11:06 AM

        “Meszároš”

        Gee, aren’t you fancy.

  20. rwbart1 - Jan 27, 2013 at 11:31 AM

    I stand with the new GM, sent Gomez packing and soon PK will find himself eating cheesestakes at
    Geno’s on 9th & Passyunk Sts. Couturier for PK even up, good luck Philfhy!

  21. muckthefets23 - Jan 27, 2013 at 1:51 PM

    Haha yea I’m not the fancy one, it’s the phone, somehow it knew what accent marks to put in there.

  22. westof1club - Jan 27, 2013 at 3:16 PM

    Guy is worth more than Mike Green (6 million) or John Carlson (5+ million). Del Zotto is on a deeper team, never logs time against top forward lines, and has injury history.

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