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Report: NHLPA dropped demand for “aftermath” protection

Dec 10, 2012, 1:53 PM EDT

Fehr and players

Remember when the NHLPA wanted protection from the “aftermath” of the lockout? Well, it still probably wants it, but it’s no longer demanding it, according to Yahoo! Sports.

The NHL Players’ Association backed off on its proposal that the players’ share could not go backwards in terms of dollars starting in Year 2. It had been a non-starter for the NHL.

Basically, under the players’ previous proposal, their combined pay would drop in Year 1 as their percentage of hockey-related revenue dropped from 57 to 50. After that, their combined pay would never be less than the previous year, even if HRR went down.

The NHL understandably wanted no part of the PA’s proposal given the uncertain future of a league that’s suffering through its third work stoppage in 20 years, not to mention the tenuous state of the economy.

“There is no way to predict,” said commissioner Gary Bettman when asked how long it would take for the NHL to recover from the work stoppage.

Yahoo! is also reporting the NHLPA proposed a limited mid-level cap exception, similar to the one in the NBA (that made Drew Gooden rich) as a way to ease the squeeze on the league’s middle class that the players have argued will be a consequence of max length contracts. (The league isn’t convinced of the argument.)

  1. id4joey - Dec 10, 2012 at 2:02 PM

    And this round goes to the owner. Are the players finally coming around to their senses? We better hope so if we want to see some of the best players fight for the next SC. Five year term limits should be a no brainer now because less than 10% of them have longer terms. Eliminate front loaded contracts to level the playing field for all teams. Oh! make that retroactive to all previously signed front loaded contracts. Another no brainer. Next CBA for 10 years with an opt out after 8 should be a no brainer as well. Most players won’t be around another 8 years anyway. What’s left? free agency and 311 million for make whole. C’mon boys! Listen to your agents who know better, and your wives who want you out of the house. This deal could have been made in Oct and you would have lost less money.

    • solador78 - Dec 10, 2012 at 2:19 PM

      If you’re going to tell hard working Americans that they can’t maximize their earnings, you should move back to Commie Pinko Land.

      • id4joey - Dec 10, 2012 at 2:32 PM

        Yes! Of course Americans are so into maximizing their earnings that they created the Internet bubble, and recently real estate bubble which resulted in a meltdown of the financial system. Make sure to tell all the hard working Americans that their own are screwing them. The Current Outstanding Public Debt of the United States is: $16,366,436,891,948.03 in case that too digits for you I will translate it; that is 16trillion and counting. LOL!

        BTW. Which part of 8 year opt out did you not understand?

      • solador78 - Dec 10, 2012 at 2:38 PM

        Next, you’re probably going to remind us that your Most Glorious Chairman owns most of that debt.

      • id4joey - Dec 10, 2012 at 3:20 PM

        solador78, sorry! You just lost me…..

      • solador78 - Dec 10, 2012 at 3:31 PM

        Hu Jintao wants to know when he can expect the $1.3 trillion that he’s owed. He’s not very happy that everyone keeps buying free hockey arenas with his money, even if it means that his sweatshops can earn double-overtime producing authentic NHL memorabilia.

      • blomfeld - Dec 10, 2012 at 4:30 PM


        Solador78 – Friend, it’s a little more involved than that. The Chinese sell their goods (junk) to the US and earn American dollars in the process. Now with those American dollar earnings, instead of then buying US made goods themselves or converting their dollar earnings back into Yuan, they tend to prefer purchasing US debt (bonds and securities). And you can’t blame them for that, as the US is still considered to be the absolute “safest” investment in the world. At any rate, the Chinese are not clamoring for their money back (ie: the 1.3 trillion they currently hold in US bonds and securities) as that is an interest-bearing investment for them, no different than you or I maintaining a savings account at the local bank.

      • solador78 - Dec 10, 2012 at 4:44 PM

        Yup, I know how it works. The Chinese can’t cash in at the moment, because the whole credit bubble would pop and that would lead to a war that they can’t win for another decade or two.

        In the meantime, Western business leaders like the NHL will continue to outsource manufacturing, while promoting fascist policies at home that undermine the American Dream.

      • blomfeld - Dec 10, 2012 at 5:36 PM


        Solador78 – No argument from me on that. The system in place today is so wrong on so many levels that I wouldn’t even know where to start ? As for the American Dream going by the wayside ? Well, that’s been happening now for probably the last 30 “plus” years or so and that’s a shame no doubt. Nonetheless, what’s really frightening is the prospect of “everyone” in the world striving to attain that American Dream, which appears to now be the case ? Just the damage already wreaked upon our planet by the material excesses of only the western world this past half century is outrageous (global warming, deforestation, poisoned and depleted ecosystems, destruction of species and natural habitat, etc). Now think what’s going to happen when everyone say in China or India has a three car garage, flat screen TV, jacuzzi and a cabin at the lake ? The world will simply cease to exist ! And yet you can’t blame them for wanting that, especially after watching us live the good life for so long, eh ? No, there has to be a better way if our species is to continue. And I say that way is by abandoning “materialism” and replacing it with a new type of thinking which strives to minimize our global footprint and live in harmony with nature, instead of trying to always destroy it ! And a good place to start with that would be for the NHLPA to accept the offer that’s now on the table ! :)

      • solador78 - Dec 10, 2012 at 5:51 PM

        I also likes savings the money.

      • blomfeld - Dec 10, 2012 at 6:17 PM

        LOL ! Good times friend ! :)

    • williplett - Dec 11, 2012 at 1:09 AM

      “Eliminate front loaded contracts to level the playing field for all teams.”-id4joey

      Did you mean level the playing field in terms of a chance to win the Cup? Because the seven years following the LAST lockout provided the greatest diversity of champions the NHL has ever seen: a different champ each season, three first time champs, two champs that hadn’t won since Bobby Orr was in the league, another team that hadn’t won the Cup in almost twenty years and three different Canadian teams made it to the Finals, as well.

      Your argument borders on blatant cheerleading for the owners and it holds no water. The owners do not need to end long term contracts to make the league more competitive; the owners just don’t want them around anymore. Funny thing: they were the ones handing them out just over a month before the lockout began…

      • id4joey - Dec 11, 2012 at 7:24 AM

        Front loaded contracts are a benefit for the wealthier teams and are used to work around then cap limit and attract the superstars. Luongo has $47,284,000 left to be paid on his contract and to be paid as shown in the left column, and how he would get paid if they agreed to have their contracts restructured.
        2012-13 – $6,714,000 – $4,728,400
        2013-14 – $6,714,000 – $4,728,400
        2014-15 – $6,714,000 – $4,728,400
        2015-16 – $6,714,000 – $4,728,400
        2016-17 – $6,714,000 – $4,728,400
        2017-18 – $6,714,000 – $4,728,400
        2018-19 – $3,382,000 – $4,728,400
        2019-20 – $1,618,000 – $4,728,400
        2020-21 – $1,000,000 – $4,728,400
        2021-22 – $1,000,000 – $4,728,400

        The current cap hit for this contract is $5,333,333, and would be $4,728,400 if they can restructure.

        The yearly amount for a restructured contract may differ. The NHL’s proposal indicated that there can be no more than a 5% differential year over year.

        Nashville spent more than they can afford to keep Weber because Snider tried using the front loaded contract to sign an RFA. They matched to keep him, but never would have offered that contract if not for the loophole.

      • williplett - Dec 11, 2012 at 2:54 PM

        The owners did this! They agreed to these deals, which you yourself claim are less than 10% of all contracts. In the case of Weber it was a team going after a RFA, which has happened about a handful of times during the post lockout era. Plus, Nashville stepped up to keep Weber. Nashville! A small market niche team.

        As far as long term contracts being a “benefit for the wealthier” teams, look no further than my Minnesota Wild. Not exactly the New York Rangers, huh? The owner and team made a splash by signing Parise and Suter. The cynicism and corpulence of the owners is on full display here: the Wild and Leipold signed the top two free agents to gigantic contracts knowing the league was going to lockout the players and they have all the hope in the world that they will get out of paying off a chunk of the contracts because people like you would be more than willing to carry their water for them.

        Funny how you completely avoided my point about the ACTUAL competetiveness of the league since the last lockout. Lackeys for the owners always do.

      • williplett - Dec 11, 2012 at 4:23 PM

        Which wealthy, big market signed the last contract of longer than five years prior to the start of the lockout? About a half hour prior to the CBA expiring, the Winnipeg Jets announced the signing of Evander Kane to a six year deal worth $31.5 mil.

        And his salary is actually scheduled to go UP as the contract proceeds.

      • id4joey - Dec 12, 2012 at 11:20 AM

        williplett, yes. The owners agreed to these long term front loaded contracts. Why? These guys are competitive business men who want to win hockey games or win in whatever business their involved in. They have legal counsel shred the CBA to pieces looking for loopholes to gain the competitive edge. Like a player who trains hard to be at his best when the puck drops. These contracts were signed under the terms of the CBA that was in place at the time. Be it 3 years or 1 week before it expired. Point being is the consequences /risks of not signing those players whether it was 3 years or 1 week before the CBA expired was the same. Losing players they felt gave the team a competitive edge on the ice. Do you really believe Nashville could afford that huge contract they gave Weber? They were forced into submission by the system, which now they believe needs to change. Everyone close to the game knew the owners would attempt to fix the CBA after it expired. Players, agents and owners knew it when the first front loaded contract was signed.

        I never wrote long term contracts are a benefit to wealthier teams. Front loaded contracts are a benefit to wealthier teams. It allows them to go after the RFA or to prevent their superstar player from becoming an RFA with a big loot of cash and minimize the cap hit, which gives cap space to spend more. let say contract terms are limited to 5 years. Under the expired CBA a team can pay a player 40 million over 5 years. He’s paid as follows;
        Year 1 / 15 million
        Year 2 / 15 million
        Year 3 / 5 million
        Year 4 / 3 million
        Year 5 / 2 million

        Under the expired CBA the cap hit would be 8 million. It’s all about the finances as opposed to who is and is not winning the cup. The owners solution is to limit contract terms and allow no more than a 5% variance in a players salary year to year. It just about the economics, and if it remains the same, then it becomes a league for the richest markets. Even though the owners created the mess there is nothing wrong with them trying to fix it. We need to look at the conflict from three perspectives: 1- as fan. 2 – as a player 3 – as an owner. If you can remain objective then you can rationalize.

  2. cspsrbums - Dec 10, 2012 at 2:13 PM

    Really 10 year CBA so the 16 y/I that makes the NHL will have no say for probably his whole career that’s nice screw the future players

    • id4joey - Dec 10, 2012 at 2:36 PM

      Good point. Lets do the math Einstein. The average 16 year old wont make the NHL until he’s 22, give or take a year. Six years from now, and with an opt out after 8 the PA will be negotiating by the time he’s 24. What’s be problem?

    • ibieiniid - Dec 10, 2012 at 2:42 PM

      i hate to spoil your sprinkle party but 95% of the players don’t have a say right now.

  3. cspsrbums - Dec 10, 2012 at 2:36 PM

    Maybe a 6 year opt out

    • id4joey - Dec 10, 2012 at 2:39 PM

      6 year opt out is fine on an 8 year deal. Owners will not accept anything less than that. But, I suspect 10 and 8 is better considering the harm that has been done stemming from this conflict.

      • joshuakorr - Dec 10, 2012 at 3:23 PM

        Its certainly better for the fans – at least with the recent string of lockouts.

  4. cspsrbums - Dec 10, 2012 at 2:43 PM

    Right 24 for a 16 y/o some kids enter next year yes I was referring to 6-8 year

  5. cspsrbums - Dec 10, 2012 at 2:54 PM

    Your right they don’t have a say but you don’t know where the league will be in a decade probably right where were at though

  6. bcsteele - Dec 10, 2012 at 3:10 PM

    I don’t know what I want more, the lockout to end or for id4joey to just quit.

    Brough, y’all should offer him a job, apparently he knows more than you do.

    • id4joey - Dec 10, 2012 at 3:26 PM

      Well! Excuse me for using my brain to educate myself, and make friends. You should try educating yourself instead of pissing on people. Doing so will allow you to have opinions with substance.

      • bcsteele - Dec 10, 2012 at 3:36 PM

        Exactly, you used your brain…not an education. And with how many people I’ve seen on these post that think about like me in regards to your thoughts, I’d say everyone is pissing on you.

        As far as my opinion, I’m very well aware of everything that’s going on do have a very specific, educated opinion. However, since I’m not a player, or owner, and am simply a lowly fan they care nothing about…what does it matter?

      • id4joey - Dec 10, 2012 at 4:03 PM

        Oh! I see bcsteele. You seek solace in the fact that you are following the herd to greener pastures because the majority must be right. How dare you use your education to think outside the box. It much easier to be mainstream. Really! Is that who you are?

      • id4joey - Dec 10, 2012 at 4:05 PM

        bcsteele, in case you missed it; Excuse me for using my brain to educate myself I suppose you’re practicing selective reading.

      • blomfeld - Dec 10, 2012 at 4:44 PM

        Joey – Thanks for the non-stop entertainment friend ! These discussions which you have with some of these people here are priceless ! :) By the way, the average human being utilizes approximately 5% of their overall mental capacity. With sheep however, it’s unfortunately estimated to be “somewhat” less than that …

      • id4joey - Dec 10, 2012 at 5:19 PM

        Glad to hear you are being entertained by all this. Knowing that some are laughing makes it worth while. You keep doing the same.

      • bcsteele - Dec 10, 2012 at 5:04 PM

        If you’re going to talk about brain power and education at least use correct grammar and spelling, it helps.

    • id4joey - Dec 10, 2012 at 6:05 PM

      blomfeld, most here have their heads so far up their derrieres they can’t tell when I’m yanking their chain or being serious. Are these imbeciles the future leaders of the free world? LOL! Please tell me their is still hope….

      • id4joey - Dec 10, 2012 at 6:07 PM

        Oh! Sh*t. grammar mistake… Can you spot it before mrboltlighningchain?

      • bcsteele - Dec 10, 2012 at 6:13 PM

        “Please tell me their is still hope….”

        It’s “Please tell me THERE’S still hope…”

        Or, “Please tell me THERE IS still hope…”

        Nice education…THERE’S no hope for you…

      • id4joey - Dec 10, 2012 at 6:32 PM

        And the winner is bcsteele. You can expect your winning prize to arrive soon. We’re giving away a pair of NHL tickets for all games from October to Dec 2012 for a team of your choice. Congrats.

      • blomfeld - Dec 10, 2012 at 7:01 PM

        Friend … I would venture to say that if your supporters here were to be linked up in a chain, then such chain would likely circumnavigate the globe “many” times over ! :) Even my old friend Stransky (ie: he’s a physicist and an expert in forensic causation analysis) who’s currently lecturing at the University of Mannheim is a big fan of yours ! Only yesterday he sent me a message saying … “I sink zat zis Joseph ist zehr funny und zehr schmart !”

        In all seriousness though, we humans are by and large a “herd-like” species no different than sheep, cows, horses, fish, birds, etc. We like to think we’re “all that” and so superior to everything else, etc … but we aren’t. Just take the example of salmon here in the Pacific Northwest. Using nothing but a pea-sized brain and a little instinct, they’re able to courageously swim 5,000 miles all the way from the Bearing Sea right up to some remote stream in central BC ! Now compare that to one of these new-age “know it all” techno punks. You take away their gadgets and they can’t add “2 plus 2” or even make it from one end of the block to the other ! Truly unbelievable eh ? No, we humans are by and large no different than some herd of sheep following the commands of a shepherd. Safety is sought in numbers and anyone in the flock who dares to think otherwise will often receive scorn, as the flock fears potential repercussions from the shepherd

        ps: getting back to fish … I bet you anything that a school of salmon “armed” with the ability to speak English would probably have this lockout solved faster than it takes Daly to comb his hair ! :)

  7. voltron217 - Dec 10, 2012 at 3:20 PM

    If a 16 y old player doesn’t like the terms of a 10 year CBA then he can play some where else! Just as if you don’t like your job you go find a better one. The patients should never run the asylum.

  8. dannythebisforbeast - Dec 10, 2012 at 4:27 PM

    Joey, you are officially a dope and talk out of your a$$. Please just keep quoting your sources and do not attempt to think on your own. It’s painful.

    • id4joey - Dec 10, 2012 at 4:34 PM

      Well beastydanny, this is pure entertainment. Glad to see you acknowledge that I have sources. You have to admit that it’s amazing the amount of clicks that I generate for this site. Their revenues are going to triple just because of little old me. Too funny! In case you haven’t noticed, I enjoy going one on one. Never back down from a fight is the best advice I’ve had…. Oh. Especially when it from behind a keyboard, LOL!

      • phillyphanatic77 - Dec 10, 2012 at 5:25 PM

        Ive disagreed with joey and blom many, many times but they’re still entitled to their opinions. Even if they’re wrong. People get overly heated about the things they post. Maybe it’s cuz you and blom seemingly tend to justify the actions of Bettman and the owners, and since we can’t taunt Bettman we take our lockout frustrations out on you two. Either way it’s entertaining, I like a good arguement.

      • id4joey - Dec 10, 2012 at 5:47 PM

        Hear, hear, phillyphanatic77. It is indeed entertaining, and no one is right or wrong when formulating an opinion. This is beyond a good argument…. It’s an on slaught and an attemps to defame my character, and sources.

        PS mrbluechain…. Can you please verify my grammar?

      • blomfeld - Dec 10, 2012 at 5:48 PM

        Get your “BETTMAN ROCKS” t-shirts now !

    • blomfeld - Dec 10, 2012 at 7:08 PM

      and you “Beastyboy” are a salmon … Coho to be exact ! :)

  9. cspsrbums - Dec 10, 2012 at 7:25 PM

    What a bunch of tree huggers maybe that’s why we are not watching hockey they are trying to save the planet. Uses to much energy to keep the ice frozen. R u serious you clowns

  10. Asdrubael - Dec 10, 2012 at 9:23 PM

    @bcsteele – You are the one that needs the grammar lesson, doofus.

    If you’re going to talk about brain power and education at least use correct grammar and spelling, it helps.

    If you’re going to talk about brain power and education is a conditional clause. This means that it should be followed by a comma. Based on your statements, however, you would’ve already known this. You know… because of all that brain power and education you have.

    Secondly, the comma after the word “spelling” creates a comma splice – the division of two independent clauses by a comma. This isn’t proper grammar. You would need either a semicolon, a coordinating conjunction, or a period.

    More often than not, you should simply avoid trashing other people’s grammar on internet forums. You should especially avoid this when they make far more astute points than you without the assinine insults.

    @blomfeld – I agree entirely with you on the NHLPA and on the abject horror that an industrialized China or India poses for the environment. Take into account also that both nations will inevitably have to deal with the fact that their sweatshop workers will no longer want to lead such lives when their burgeoning middle class is millions strong, and you have a recipe for outright disaster. Scary stuff.

    • blomfeld - Dec 10, 2012 at 11:05 PM

      Person A: who’s this Asdrubael guy ?

      Person B: I’m not sure friend, however his words are those of truth and reason

      Asdrubael – Thank you friend for your reply, as it’s always refreshing to hear an “intelligent” voice here at PHT ! :) In all seriousness though, we humans as a species are now likely doomed to ultimately doing ourselves in … and it’s probably going to happen a lot sooner than we think ? The irony or “paradox” of our so-called “intelligence” is that it’s actually leading us “ever” faster to an abyss, as opposed to saving us like it’s constantly advertised by those who “profit” by selling it. Instead of cutting 100 x trees down per minute, our intelligence has enabled us to cut 1,000,000 x trees down per minute. Instead of catching 50 x fish per hour, our intelligence has enabled us to catch 5,000,000 x fish down per minute. And on and on it goes with virtually everything that we touch in life. I honestly don’t know if the answer is for people to resist that, or just go with the flow and have a “good time” while it lasts ?

  11. Asdrubael - Dec 11, 2012 at 6:57 AM

    I’m a long time reader and sports fan. In my every day life, I’m an English teacher. Rarely am I that pedantic, but ignorance really bothers me.

    Thanks for the kind words as well. I agree with you in terms of how our intelligence is rapidly dooming us, and I am curious what the next fifty years hold for this world. By that same stroke, technology may be the only thing that can save us from ourselves. Radical change isn’t something humanity does well without an extreme impetus behind it. We can only hope that bio-engineered crops and advances in the medical and agricultural industries can abate the issues over-population seems likely to dump on us. In addition, I really think China and India will have some very serious questions to answer as their poor begin seeing so many others in their nation ascending in class and begin demanding Civil Rights, unions, fair pay, etc. Both of those nations could damn well implode horrifically. In addition, we may well be seeing the last days of out-sourcing as the rest of the world is doing exactly as you said – they’re now “American dreamers.” The allure of earning cents on the dollar as a glorified slave is being replaced by the idea that each human has legitimate potential. Africa remains the last likely frontier for cheap labor if China and India modernize to the point of having regulated labor, unions, etc. We’ll obviously have to see how things go, cross our fingers, and pray for the best. In the mean time, I wish we could just have hockey back.

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