Comments on: Bettman feels “terrible” about impending lockout, but owners have their reasons

By: tealwithit

tealwithit — Sat, 15 Sep 2012 22:02:26 +0000

I agree with you on the first paragraph… Can’t comment on the second… Have to disagree on part of the third. The current agreement doesn’t work, and I think everyone has come to the point where they can at least agree that changes need to be made. Players probably won’t admit that, considering they’d love to continue playing under the current deal – but 57% is just too high, especially after the NBA and NFL just came down to 47-51%. They also need to close some of the loopholes.
Bettman sees himself as a lawyer, first and foremost, and a representative of the league. The players have a rep of their own to look out for their best interests. I’ve never shadowed the guy, so I really don’t know what all his job consists of, or what kind of pressure he’s under, or how he comes to his decisions. I can’t imagine being in his shoes, though… That’s gotta be one of the most thankless jobs in sports.
But yes, the game itself is great and it’s pulling in more fans every season. Both sides know that the NHL’s progress and growing fan base is on the line, and I really think (or at least hope) that they’re smart enough to make compromises, meet in the middle, and get the season started before December.

By: tealwithit

tealwithit — Sat, 15 Sep 2012 21:42:00 +0000

Haha. I live in San Jose – 75 degrees and sunny year-round. As far as my stupidity… Look, I’m not teaching myself all of this off the internet. I do know what I’m talking about, but I tend to struggle with articulating my opinion and bringing all relevant facts and figures to back it up (I’m kind of like Romney in that way), without ending up writing a small book on a PHT comment thread.
But I’m working on it. Because I do feel like I have a different perspective on this situation than a lot of people, given the hours and hours I’ve spent talking to someone who went through this with the NBA years ago and is more than a little familiar with the NHL’s issues. So when I talk to him and learn things that I can’t find anywhere on the internet, I feel the need to share that with other people, in case they are like me and want to know everything there is to know. I’m not at all trying to make it sound like I’m special and or smarter than you. I know I’m no business genius… I just talk hockey with one a few times a week and do my best to learn from his experience and insight. Anyways. I just want you to know where I’m coming from. Hostility makes me sweat.
p.s. Record “revenue.” $3.3 billion in “revenue.” Revenue does not equal profit. Since 2005, player salaries have seen a substantial increase and operating costs have risen. The owners made a stupid deal last time, and yes, that’s their own fault. They need to get serious about revenue sharing and finding ways to improve the league’s health, other than forcing immediate rollbacks on player salaries. But I also think the players need to recognize that even though they gave up “enormous concessions” last time, the current CBA has actually ended up working heavily in their favor, and they may need to somehow come down to a 50-50 split over the course of the next one. CBAs have expiration dates for a reason – Things change over the years, and the terms of the deal usually need to be re-evaluated and amended. But both sides have to be willing to come to the table to get it done.

By: tealwithit

tealwithit — Sat, 15 Sep 2012 20:58:44 +0000

Forbes: “During the 2010-11 season the league posted operating income (earnings before interest, taxes, depreciation and amortization) of $126 million, 21% lower than the previous year. Main reason: Player costs increased 11%, to $59 million. Last season 18 of the league’s 30 teams lost money even before they had to pay bank loans or write down assets, compared with 16 the prior year.”
Here’s the list: http://www.forbes.com/nhl-valuations/
Operating incomes are the numbers you want to look at. Given what I’ve heard from NBA and NHL execs, Forbes’ numbers tend to run a little high. So I’d probably allow for +/- $5 mill.

By: tealwithit

tealwithit — Sat, 15 Sep 2012 20:45:44 +0000

Okay, we get it. Bettman’s the antichrist and the owners have no class. Thank you for bringing the petty name-calling and gratuitous virulence, once again.

By: pajabroni

pajabroni — Sat, 15 Sep 2012 07:09:39 +0000

That original comment has nothing to do with the towns and cities hurt more so than Pittsburgh, Philly and NJ. Your sarcasm is unnecessary. Every city is affected, not just the small market ones.

THINK ABOUT ALL OF THE VENDORS and GAMEDAY EMPLOYEES now trying to find jobs to feed their families now that the league is not playing games.

By: habsfaninnb

habsfaninnb — Fri, 14 Sep 2012 22:21:04 +0000

I’m Canadian living in Oklahoma, would like to know if anyone knows is there any of the major junior hockey played that can be viewed on the Internet.

By: tatdue

tatdue — Fri, 14 Sep 2012 22:04:50 +0000

@tealwithit – Not cutting it eh? How about 7 years of record revenue??? How about 3.3 Billion in revenue??? Not cutting it….What’s not cutting it is you and your stupidity, what rock did you crawl out from under? I’m not normally this much of an ars but man your stupidity bugs me…put your suspenders on and go gripe about the weather or something but please quit talking about this stuff because you clearly don’t know what you are talking about……

By: tatdue

tatdue — Fri, 14 Sep 2012 21:53:53 +0000

@tealwithit – Why do you say things that are absolute lies???? “Two-thirds of the league’s teams are losing money” is an absolute lie….not once has even the Goblin Turd tried to say anything as absurd as that…..There are only a handful of teams losing money and the worst one is owned by the NHL (I wonder why that is?) All the Turd has claimed is that the teams that did lose money collectively lost 240 million, which of course is why he is demanding over a billion back the owners way (over the course of their proposal)….

By: tatdue

tatdue — Fri, 14 Sep 2012 21:37:40 +0000

It’s not about the 57% – The players have offered to move on that….it’s about Bettman and the owners wanting to welch on existing contracts that is the problem….The Goblin Turd and the owners add up to zero class on this move…or the move of locking out the players and putting a lot of innocent people out of work in the process to accomplish this classless act!!!

By: yvrmike

yvrmike — Fri, 14 Sep 2012 19:55:47 +0000

Chizmo (below)- Before you write something please think through what you are gonna write
Example genious – Mario is an owner – did you know that?
Former players that work for NHL teams are just employees not owners, they can have opinions but they may be fired by someone like Mario for having a different opinion than him.
Another x-NHL player / owner is Ron Francis and he and Mario should step up and ask Bettman to be fired.
Why should they step up and ask Bettman to be fired you say. Just ask yourself this question. Where would they Ron and Mario be today if they did not play hockey?
A shot at Mario you bet, Id say it to his face. Im all for the players bud.
Is it olive oil or canola oil?

By: truebluefred

truebluefred — Fri, 14 Sep 2012 19:04:47 +0000

Well spoken! In this economy walking the grocery store last night, I was trying to decide if I wanted to drop $7.99 on a pound of coffee which has become a luxury. As a die hard fan, where is our representation at the negotiating table? All the tickets and jerseys and “officially licensed” products we spend our hard earned money on – when’s our vote coming? I’m with manchestermiracle – empty a few seats, buy one less Sidney Crosby jersey – let the NHL and Players know that people who PAY their enormous salaries, enable their advertising revenues, open their cable contracts and buy their swag have had enough and are taking our meek disposable income elsewhere. Don’t “feel bad for the fans,” Mr. Commissioner, do your damned job – we’re YOUR Board of Directors and I for one WILL reinvest my extra cash elsewhere. This condescending “for the fans crap” doesn’t go over as well with hockey fans as it may with other professional sports. If I went to work and decided to shut the company down for a year because I couldn’t get labor to work with management, I would get tossed out a window.

By: fortwaynekomets

fortwaynekomets — Fri, 14 Sep 2012 18:47:42 +0000

the NHL os done if they do a lockout. I know so many fans who gave it one last chance after the first one.. might as well make the funeral arrangements and dog the grave already.

HOWEVER, THANK GOD WE HAVE THE A.H.L. AND THE E.C.H.L. !!!!!!

By: shawniebear7634

shawniebear7634 — Fri, 14 Sep 2012 18:21:03 +0000

Dear God-please don’t tell me this means I’ll have to start watching FOOTBALL this season. Sigh.

By: chizmo

chizmo — Fri, 14 Sep 2012 15:48:18 +0000

Taking a shot at Mario? Really? Why would he need to support the players when he is now on the other side? Would you have all of the former players currently working in NHL front office also come out in support of the players? How about former players who are now coaches? Should they revolt against the ownership that pays them?

Way to make a completely ridiculous comment, followed by a pointless personal insult. It really makes you sound intelligent!

By: yvrmike

yvrmike — Fri, 14 Sep 2012 15:24:38 +0000

Just wondering where Mario Lemieux is in all this. Hey Mario don’t forget where you came from and start supporting the players. If you dont start supporting the players you will look like an idiot.
And stop putting that olive oil on your face.

By: mhazz84

mhazz84 — Fri, 14 Sep 2012 15:15:56 +0000

A thousand thumbs up to this.

By: mhazz84

mhazz84 — Fri, 14 Sep 2012 15:11:08 +0000

I feel like Bettman pooped in my food and made me eat it.

By: blueswincup

blueswincup — Fri, 14 Sep 2012 14:35:39 +0000

Seriously, a sports commissioner’s job is NOT to pander to the owners wishes. It is to take care of the game and it’s integrity and make sure neither the owners nor the players do things to bring shame on the game. Lockouts and strikes are shameful in pro sports with all the money involved. Plenty for everybody.

For example, the best commissioner of the past decades of any sport was Paul Tagliabue. He didn’t take crap from the owners of the NFL. He got them to see past their own greed and come up with decisions that were good for the game. No lockouts, no strikes, labor peace defined Tagliabue’s NFL regime. He wasn’t perfect but he always had the good of the game at the forefront of what he did and he was able to influence the owners and players to come to agreement without embarassing themselves.

Bettman does not do this one bit. He simply does what the owners tell him to do. He isn’t supposed to do that. He is supposed to see beyond the owners greedy wishes and protect the integrity of the game. Who is complaing right now? It’s not the players, it’s the owners. This current agreement works and should simply be re-upped for another 10 years. The game is healthy, fans love it, and the action on the ice is fantastic. The owners are throwing all this away and Bettman is just along for the ride. He is a HORRIBLE commisioner.

By: manchestermiracle

manchestermiracle — Fri, 14 Sep 2012 14:12:45 +0000

The owners will be counting on that sentiment. After they have yet another lock-out they’ll be hoping there are lots of fans just like you. I don’t blame you, but I don’t see this cycle ending any time soon unless hard-core fans (those who spend their hard-earned dollars to attend games) step back and hurt the league where it really counts: In the wallet. Take a page from the big-money side and take a break from the game. Arenas with more empty seats than filled ones will be the only message owners and players hear. And, to me, the only “sad thing” about all this is the inability of the NHL and all its participants to resolve their differences and play some damn hockey.

By: blueswincup

blueswincup — Fri, 14 Sep 2012 13:58:52 +0000

Fans memo to NHL owners:

Fool me once (2004 lockout) shame on me (Yes, you guys fooled me in 2004. I really thought the NHL was in dire financial trouble that year and you guys would figure out how to make the game viable for decades to come).

Fool me twice (Nope, not fooled this time. Owners are simply greedy, lying sacks of you know what.)

F the owners and F Gary Bettman

I will not be attending any games this year. The sad thing is the owners don’t even care.

By: lordfletcher

lordfletcher — Fri, 14 Sep 2012 13:48:23 +0000

Oh sure, bettman relocated the Penguins and Flyers and Devils didn’t he? Everyone hates the man

Get in line with some of the towns and cities that really were affected.

By: spavs412

spavs412 — Fri, 14 Sep 2012 13:40:09 +0000

What about us the fans? I’ve already paid for my season tickets this yr. Weak sauce can I have my money back?

By: lpd1964

lpd1964 — Fri, 14 Sep 2012 13:07:29 +0000

I enjoy hockey and this situation is very perplexing. For a sport that is still trying to get a legitimate TV deal, (sorry the NBC thing seems part time to me) why in the hell would you go down the lockout route? Sell your sport, don’t sell it out.

By: elemeno89

elemeno89 — Fri, 14 Sep 2012 13:06:13 +0000

no i dont think that. but i do believe as “owners” of a small market team, bettman did have influence over teams such as nashville and florida, to create some sentiment that they are playing their players too much. especially after the off season spending spree by fla (who struggled to get to the floor) and nashville who commited over 110 mil to their franchise player, only to have a ntc in his contract. those teams who have a reason to complain about losing too much money, can have a big influence on the big guys.

By: tealwithit

tealwithit — Fri, 14 Sep 2012 05:08:28 +0000

Guys. Really? We’re still blaming it all on Bettman?
“Acquiring big-ticket corporate partners and negotiating CBAs are his primary jobs. His job is to increase the franchise value of the owners. That’s it. He’s largely done that, especially for the top-tier franchises, as is reflected in his salary. He has a high salary because he has been good for the owners; otherwise, he would be commissioner of the Arena Football League. Bettman has the charm of a heavily starched shirt, but he is smart and relentless. He organized and professionalized the offices of the NHL, increased revenues and helped oversee the new-media infusion that has made this the best time, in terms of media access and information, to be a fan of the NHL.” – John Buccigross
Bettman doesn’t get paid to be a representative for the fans. He gets his marching orders from the owners. If the owners didn’t want a lockout, there wouldn’t be one. And yes, the owners are overspending and they do need to have rules in place to protect them from themselves, but that’s because they’re competitive. They want their team to win a Stanley Cup just as much as the fans do. So, while they’re all about “the overall health of the league” during CBA negotiations, as soon as the deal is in place and hockey resumes, they’re going to do everything they can to win under the terms of the new agreement – which means outbidding each other and exploiting loopholes, if that’s what it takes. And as a fan, win-at-all-costs is the kind of attitude that I want driving the organization that I’m financially and emotionally invested in.

By: johnwwt1976

johnwwt1976 — Fri, 14 Sep 2012 04:51:24 +0000

Douche bag Bettman!!!!!!

By: tealwithit

tealwithit — Fri, 14 Sep 2012 04:22:45 +0000

Yeah that’s been done. NHL execs don’t get paid during this lockout.

By: tealwithit

tealwithit — Fri, 14 Sep 2012 04:20:51 +0000

Raising revenue without cutting costs means raising ticket prices.
Sure, they can generate revenue through other avenues, like TV deals and sponsorships, but every team has a staff that spends their days working to do just that – and clearly that’s not cutting it.

By: 1943mrmojorisin1971

1943mrmojorisin1971 — Fri, 14 Sep 2012 04:16:53 +0000

Obviously you’re far from the only one who thinks so. I thought Elliotte Friedman put it well here:

http://www.cbc.ca/sports/hockey/opinion/2012/09/bettman-should-consider-stepping-away-from-talks.html

Gary should step away and never, ever step back.

By: tealwithit

tealwithit — Fri, 14 Sep 2012 04:11:51 +0000

paperkid – Come up with a business plan to become profitable in three years? Two-thirds of the league’s teams are losing money, and you really think it’s as simple as “They just aren’t trying hard enough”?
The salary floor is in place for a reason, and that reason is parity. Nobody wants to see the same teams in the playoffs every year (except maybe the fans of those teams.) That doesn’t benefit the league and it’s not fair to the rest of the fans.